Catherine Watkin is the UK’s leading expert in heart-centered sales.
An authentic, inspiring role model for business owners who are gifted and passionate about what they do but struggle because they feel awkward about using traditional sales,
Catherine reveals how to create successful businesses without resorting to sleazy, manipulative techniques.

  • Could not recommend it enough!
    March 18, 2019 by Mindful Mel from United States

    Listening to Heart Sells Podcast has felt like meeting a soulmate! That initial excitement of knowing this is exactly what you’ve been looking for, the peace of feeling completely understood and that burst of energy from knowing that anything is possible! Every episode has been chock full of awesome nuggets and beautiful reminders. The combination of incredibly successful powerhouses sharing their journey, practical and applicable tools and Christine’s heartfelt and authentic approach and energy, is an incredible gift for all heart-centered entrepreneurs!

  • Dondi Scumaci - Don't let a bad experience creep into your heart
    January 19, 2019 by WalkingInside from Canada

    Loved the interview! Dondi has a great way of reminding us that we get to choose the lesson in our experiences.

  • Amazing Podcast!
    January 5, 2019 by LaDawn Townsend from United States

    I just started listening to Christine's podcast and the content is amazing! Can't wait for the next episdoe.

  • Packed with Powerful & Practical Tips!
    December 24, 2018 by VanPavlik from United States

    Love this podcast! The lifeblood of any business is sales and Christine does an amazing job of making sales something you'll fall in love with instead of dread. These podcasts are short and get staright to the point, filling you with both the knowledge and motivation to go out and bring in lots more money to your business by selling from your heart. If you want to bury the notion that sales is sleazy or avoid "gurus" who make sales sleazy and instead learn to how to sell in a way that is heart-centered, easy, win-win, and non-pushy, then look no further... you have found the right podcast!

  • Mindset Makes The Difference
    December 17, 2018 by JanineFQ from United States

    Great show about creating a business with heart. If you think it, you can achieve it and Christine show you how to use your heart and mind to find success. I'll listen again.

  • Loved the JLD Interview
    December 16, 2018 by Thehighenergygirl from United States

    Wow, what a great interview with JLD. Christine your energy is great and I look forward to listening to your other episodes. Well done! BTW I love the title so much!

  • Follow your heart!
    December 14, 2018 by The Marketing Book Podcast from United States

    ... and your mindset will take it from there. Yogi Berra once said "90% of the game is half mental." With your heart and mind aligned (like planets) you'll be amazed at what you can accomplish. Subsribe, listen and start selling!

  • Afraid to sell? Listen here!
    December 13, 2018 by MizzBeeMe from United States

    These are wonderful interviews with successful entrepreneurs, (including the Queen of Sales Mindset, host Christine)......who share how they began, what their difficulties were, and the sales mindsets & strategies they used to get to their top. If you've ever had that icky feeling when it come to 'selling' you or your stuff....get some great inspiration here of not only how to sell, but how to think.

  • Feeling P.O.W.E.R. ful!
    December 10, 2018 by The Variety Artist from United States

    Just listened to ep 5. Love the POWER formula. Christine explains it clearly and makes it simple for me to understand. Great podcast!

  • Let’s get better at selling!
    December 9, 2018 by Joeb29 from United States

    Let’s be honest, we can ALL be better at selling. I know I can, and I’ve been studying selling for years! Have a listen if you want to start getting better. I’d recommend it!

  • Inspirational!
    December 8, 2018 by CCarroll1 from United States

    Christine is a joy to listen to and learn from! I am so glad she now has a podcast so I can keep learning from her wisdom on sales, money, mindset, business and more. Great information!

  • You had me at "hi gorgeous!"
    December 8, 2018 by The Chef Rock Xperiment from United States

    Wonderful energy and such valuable insight! Thank you, Christine!

  • Love this podcast!
    December 8, 2018 by Funky Sarica from United States

    Christine does such an incredible job of helping her listeners to find their way with selling with love, from the heart. Her guests offer so much value—looking forward to more interviews!

  • Beautifl Show
    December 8, 2018 by Duffash from United States

    Christine has a wonderful energy. She is a great coach and teacher. I love how she teaches tools for shifting our mindset into creating habits and behaviors that build our success.

  • Christine is Great!
    December 8, 2018 by horsegirldsi from United States

    Have gotten a lot of value out of the first episodes. Christine is a great host!

  • We need more of this...
    December 7, 2018 by Stu Schaefer from United States

    I'm an entrepreneur and I sell every day of my life. It's easy to neglect the heart side of things, but I think it's important to balance that since we're all humans on the same team. Christine does a great job providing really valuable insights!


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Resources Mentioned in this Episode:

Free Gift: The 7 Steps To Yes, short video series

Heart Sells! Magic A 5-day workshop where I will take you through the Heart Sells! Power Formula, so you can sell more with ease, grace and confidence.

Sales Assessment Call: A 30-minute free call to evaluate your sales skills strengths, as well as identify the skills that need some refining so you can take your next best step forward in your business.

Empowerment Notes, Join the Empowerment Notes our weekly newsletter and I’ll make sure you have all the info you need to be empowered.

Get 40 Strategies to fill your pipeline with amazing clients with the Heart-Centered Lead Generation Summit Experience

3 Key Points:

  • At every point of your sales conversation, always set things up so that your potential client knows that it’s completely fine with you if they decide to say no.
  • To make sure that you always sort of have your clients permission to go into the pieces that could potentially come across as salesy
  • Reining in your passion because when you’re really passionate about making a difference, you can often run in and come on a bit strong without realizing it.

Show Notes:

[9:21] Letting go of the label entrepreneur would be helpful, you can let go of this pressure to be entrepreneurial, you can build something simple and nurturing and sustainable that suits you and your lifestyle.

[10:59] It’s a lifestyle question is such an important one to figure out what’s right for you? Because success is not a general definition, everybody has their own definition of success.

[12:11] The fear of becoming the fear of coming across as pushy, or self-serving actually stops small business owners from even entering into these sales conversations.

[12:50] People are passionate, they really want to make a difference, and that can accidentally come across as pushy.

[23:05] If you’ve got the internal yes, these concerns become things that you can coach and guide and work through with the clients to help them come to that decision.

[25:48] for all sorts of reasons, not everyone will be able to come to a decision there and then on that call.

[26:22] You want to be helping people through that so that you know exactly what the maybe is, always booking the next call, so you never leaving it open-ended.

[27:38] As the person who’s doing the selling, you always know where you stand, and where that person is on that sort of continuum of seriousness.

[29:40] Heart-centered sales are not soft sales, how its service at the highest level, and how we serve our clients by being willing to be courageous in those sales conversations.


I am so over the moon to have Catherine back on the show today and I just loved our conversation. “How To Get Your Internal Yes“. So if you have not checked out Episode 333 I highly recommend you do but in this episode, we will be talking about “How Not To Come Across Pushy, Sleazy, or Salesy” and I’m quite sure you as a heart-centered, ambitious entrepreneur will really appreciate this conversation. Catherine Watkin is the UK’s leading expert in heart-centered sales. She’s an authentic, inspiring role model for business owners who are gifted and passionate about what they do but struggle because they feel awkward about using traditional sales. Catherine reveals how to create successful businesses without resorting to sleazy manipulative techniques. So this is probably exactly what you want. And this is what will get you to your next level if you really understand that selling from the heart will help you to tune in to service to showing up as your best self having the clients interest in mind and Catherine is going to go deep on her process which I truly enjoyed having her talk about and I can’t wait for you to have a listen.

In case we have not met yet. I am Christine Schlonski, founder of Heart Sells! Academy, creator of Heart Sells! Members Community and the host of this wonderful podcast you are listening to right now Heart Sells! Podcast, where I talk with inspirational successful heart-centered entrepreneurs and business leaders about how they have built a wildly successful business. And in many cases, they themselves had to overcome some challenges in sales. Some of my amazing past guests include the wonderful Bob Burg, the co-author of the “Go-Giver Series” and the author of “Endless Referrals”. The great Ian Altman the Same Side Selling, one of the global top gurus when it comes to sales. Andrea Waltz “Go for No” and Susie Carter, the profit coach.

So I am so super pumped you are here. This episode is brought to you by Heart Sells! Academy. And at Heart Sales! Academy, we support heart-centered ambitious entrepreneurs who really want to sell with their heart, from their heart want to feel amazing when selling. We do a ton of mindset work. So if you are looking to feel amazing and a sales conversation, actually turning a sales conversation into a fun conversation, you are in the right place. You can learn more at And you can also book your sales assessment where we will help you determine your next best move. And also we’ll show you ways how you could work with us. So thank you so much for being here. And let’s dive into this wonderful topic of “How Not To Come Across Pushy, Sleazy or Salesy”. Well, I am so super pumped. You are back on the show. Catherine. Welcome.

Thank you for having me back. I mean, looking forward to continuing the conversation.

Yeah, I just love talking to you. And that might be because we’re so aligned with our mission, which is

We really are

Selling From The Heart, Heart Sells! And you said that sales service I obviously sales is love. So it just feels so wonderful. Just one thing before we go into more of how to not be pushy or come across as pushy or sleazy on the in the conversation, not necessarily on the phone, but in a sales conversation at all. Do you remember the very first thing that you ever sold in your life?

Oh, I think I do. So when I was 23 years old, I was working in an admin role and waitressing in the evenings. And a friend of mine got a job as a tour rep over in the Greek Islands. So of course, I got all excited by this and I decided I want to be a tour rep and I got a job and they sent us off the training. And the training was nearly all sales training. I had no idea I thought I was going out to look after the holidaymakers. And so my job was to go to the airport in the middle of the night. Bring back coach loads of holidaymakers, drop them off at their hotel, and then the first thing the next morning, stand in front of them and tell them about all the fabulous day trips, they could take on the island and sell them their day trips. And that was how I got paid through the commission for that. So the very first thing I sold would have been like the round the island trip, round cars, or the go-to and buy herbs in the mountain village trip. It was one of those.

Oh, how fun. Have you got to travel? Right? I think we also share the love for travel. Yeah, so cool. And is there anything before that? Like, did you already start selling something as a child? Or like, oh, was that the first time where you got paid?

Yeah, no, I don’t see myself as a natural salesperson or a natural entrepreneur. You know, you have the entrepreneurs who say, you know, I was selling lemonade out the front of my parents home when I was three, I didn’t have that. I didn’t have those bones in my body. You know, both of my parents are public sector workers. My dad was a teacher, my mum was a social worker, I was just brought up to not value money, but to want to help people for a living. So sales and entrepreneurship, it’s not in my DNA. So no, until I accidentally ended up in a job where I was required to sell things, which was a real shock to me at the time. This wasn’t me either. But this was in my early 20s. So I did get an early garena. By the time I was in my 30s. Sales were like breathing to me, it was as easy as brushing my teeth. And I didn’t really understand why other people struggled with it in the way that they seem to.

Yeah, so so fun. Okay. Yeah, they’re all these amazing stories of people who sold something at a very early age. But there also comes very interesting learning with it. Some people they got in trouble, right? Or they were balloon, or their parents told them never ever do that, again. Because they took money for whatever selling dirt. And then other people got really amazing experiences. And I’m always curious, how did that play out on your entrepreneurial journey? Like how, how were you able to take that experience and create your success that you have now? Or you had to overcome some things? So I love these conversations.

Yeah, I think I’m definitely in the overcoming category. You know, I was definitely brought up to not value money. And in actual fact, to look on people with money with, with a great deal of suspicion. I was brought up to get a good job, and work diligently and pay off my mortgage and build my pension, and all of those things. So I’m more in the I overcame, I overcame that very strict background. In order to do what I do now, which goes against the grain of my family, my family has still got no idea what I do. Just the other day, my mother offered to help me out financially. They just don’t have any concept of what I do. And I’ve been doing this for nine years. But just don’t they just don’t ask questions, they don’t understand. They just see that I spend my time at home on my laptop all day. I don’t think they have a clue.

Wow, well, yeah, I can relate. Really, like my parents don’t really understand what I do. It’s like my dad, not at all. My mom kind of gets it. But there’s like this potential worry all the time, right? If everything’s fine, why don’t I get a job? And yes, why? Why? You know, because I don’t have a job, I don’t pay into the official pension fund. And that’s gonna come and bite me later on. And like all these things. It’s not that easy to completely detach from that. So do you? What because I know a lot of people who are just brought up that way, right. And none of the successful people I have met so far are very few have had that entrepreneurial gene in them. The rest learned or made experiences that showed them that this would be a better path to take. Do you have any advice for someone who might be struggling on that entrepreneurial journey because of the background, what they could do, to kind of let go and choose a new way of looking at things?

I think one thing that some people could let go of this was something I was pondering on the other day after listening to something online, is that for some people, letting go of the label entrepreneur would be helpful. I think that label entrepreneur is loaded with meaning. And it puts a lot of pressure on us. I am an entrepreneur, so I should be aiming for growth. I’m an entrepreneur, so I should be going for six figures, seven figures, I am an entrepreneur, so I should be going big going out, and actually, some of us are small business owners. We’re not entrepreneurs. I don’t necessarily see myself as an entrepreneur. I don’t. I’m more entrepreneurial than some I’ve got a much higher appetite for risk than a lot of other people. But you know, A lot of the people in my community, they’re not entrepreneurs, they don’t see themselves as entrepreneurs. They’re small business owners, they want to grow a healthy coaching practice or a healthy business where they get to make a difference and sustains their income and their lifestyle that might not even require six figures a year to do that. And then they can, and then by letting go of this pressure to be entrepreneurial, they can build something simple and nurturing, and sustainable that suits them and their lifestyle.

So beautiful and so important. Thank you for pointing that out. And it is true. When you hear entrepreneur, you always think like, well, at least six figures, preferably seven, and potentially eight.

I think if you’re an entrepreneur, you should automatically be pursuing seven figures. And if you’re an entrepreneur, and you’re not pursuing seven figures, people are going to make you feel somehow well “what’s wrong with you”. You’re somehow less than, but this isn’t what not everybody values business growth above everything else in their life. Someone some people do. Some people don’t.

Yeah, yeah, I think it’s a lifestyle question is such an important one to figure out what’s right for you. Because success is not a general definition. It’s everybody has their own definition of success. Yeah, what makes you happy does not necessarily make me happy, or another person, so and vice versa. And just being really, really clear on what we value as an individual, for us, and maybe for our families and friends. And starting there. I think that really, really helps. Mm hmm. Beautiful. So let’s talk about the sales conversations. And so many people are afraid that they come across pushy or sleazy or salesy. These are like the three most used words when it comes to sales conversations. How do you see that? And what can what could you recommend, so people don’t fall into that trap. And they are not fearful of these conversations.

Yeah, and actually, I think that the fear of coming across as pushy, is a bigger barrier to getting clients than actually being pushy. The fear of becoming the fear of coming across as pushy, or self-serving actually stops small business owners from even entering into these sales conversations. And it stops them from conducting them confidently when they’re having them. And so there are a few things that, you know, there are a few things people can do. But the other side of that coin, of course, is that it’s easy to also get carried away to be over passionate to be over-enthusiastic. This is my weak link. Sometimes if I ever sort of lose a sale that I think I should have made, it’s usually maybe because I didn’t rein in my passion enough that you know, people are passionate, they really want to make a difference. And that can accidentally come across as pushy.

And so there’s this really, really fine balance. So I’ll try and just give you a couple of things. One, one thing I would say is that at every point of your sales conversation, always set things up so that your potential client knows that it’s completely fine with you if they decide to say no. And what this does is it removes that sense of pushing us because the client knows that the choice will ultimately be theirs. So if I was to meet somebody, let’s say that I was in a face-to-face online networking situation, and I was chatting away to somebody. And it turned out that I felt that I could help them with their business. I might say to them, Look, why don’t we get together on a separate call and have a chat. Because I think that, you know, I really feel I might be able to help you with this. And you know what, it might not be right for you. And if it’s not, then there’s no expectation on my part, things will go any further. And he’s still you know, it’s totally fine if you decide not to go ahead. But I’m really happy to have the conversation. why don’t we just hop on a call and explore?

What you’ve done there is you’ve set it up so that that potential client can go. It’s okay if I say no. And that changes the whole tone of the conversation, you can set that up again, at the beginning of the sales compensation, you can remind them you know, we’re here to explore whether this would be a good fit, you know, I don’t invite everybody to work with me. So I will be you know, you know, depending on how the conversation goes, I may or may not invite you to do further work with me. And the same goes for you. If you don’t feel this is a good fit. That’s totally fine as well. We’re here to explore this. That’s the first thing to always set it up that the potential client feels. It’s one of my little taglines, your client will only feel safe to say yes if they first feel safe to say no.

Then the next thing that you can do is to make sure that you always sort of have your clients permission to go into the pieces that could potentially come across as salesy and So this is like in my analogy, I would say I have this analogy, I have a lot of visuals in my head when I talk about sales. And I think about traditional sales as the salesperson in their shiny suits running down the street, and the clients running away from them. And they’ve got a big net that trying to catch you in their net. When I think about heart-centered sales, I think about the two people actually, instead of one chasing the other, that they’re walking side by side, they’re on a path together, they’re side by side, there maybe even holding hands. There’s this sense of mutual support, mutual collaboration, we’re on this journey, we’re figuring out this thing out together. And that when you get a certain way along that path, you get to you want.

So you want to make sure that that client is always side by side with you on the path. And if you start becoming salesy, they energetically and emotionally start running away from you. And, and one of the ways to prevent that happening is to just always make sure that, that they’re with you that you have that permission. So if I’ve been talking to a client, and I’d assessed that, yes, I really do think I can help this person, I’d be saying something like, thank you so much for everything you’ve shared so far on this call, I really appreciate your doing that. And it helps me to understand where you’re at so much better. Based on what we’ve talked about, I really do feel that I could help you with this x y Zed, and I could help you get this ABC result that you’ve talked about wanting. And is it okay with you? If I take a few minutes to explain how I would do that and how my program would work? Then you’ll get a yes.

Now, in the event, you get a no, it’s very rare probably won’t happen. But at least you’re not wasting your time talking to somebody who’s not interested, you will usually get a yes. Even if they’ll just be even if they’re just curious. But now when you start outlining how your program works, what it’s designed to do, what happens in it how much it costs, instead of them thinking, Oh, now she’s just selling to me. They’re thinking, Okay, that’s interesting, and they’re processing it for themselves because it didn’t feel salesy. And then the third piece around not being pushy, is it’s what I hinted at the beginning about reining in your passion. Because when you’re really passionate about making a difference, you can often run in and come on a bit strong without realizing it. And one of the very common things that people do, and particularly if somebody’s got a niche or a specialism that, you know, your new potential client comes and starts talking to you, they literally say two sentences, and you’re like, boom, I got it, I’ve got it, I know I can help you, oh, my gosh, come along over here into my program.

And the problem is that you’re just moving that relationship too fast. And the potential client doesn’t know that you’re having the same conversation day in day out. They need to feel that they’ve expressed where they’re at, they want to feel heard, they need to feel that you’ve really heard them and you’re responding to what they say, not just like, oh, you haven’t even listened to me, how do you know this is a good fit for me. And so there is a place in the sales conversation for in quotes selling. And the rest of the conversation is much more information gathering. And I teach a seven-step process for the sales conversation. And guess where the part where you start talking about your solution your offers, it’s actually, step six. But your client is going to start saying things in step two, that make you jump in and go, I can help I think you should do my program. So it’s this, it’s this, you know, knowing when, you know, knowing how to hold that conversation so that when you do talk about your offer, and you’re effectively selling, that comes at the right place in the conversation, because if it comes too early, the potential clients just going whoa, whoa, whoa, stay back. I’m not moving too fast. I’m not ready. And that’s when they shut down. And that’s when they say, I think everything you said is lovely. But I’m going to have to go and think about it. You know, you’ve done something, you know, you’ve got something wrong when your client ends with I need to go out and think about it.

Yeah, yeah, I so agree that sometimes we get too excited, we jump in way too fast. And then you know, listening skills come in handy. And also taking your time, right, there’s no, you don’t need to rush the conversation. And some people want to rush it because they want to get it over with. It’s so uncomfortable for them. So that’s a warning here. Yeah, see till the end, you have to hold the space. The person maybe they’ve never ever expressed themselves in the way they do with you in that conversation. And to honor that and to be with them and to show them that giving them already a taste of what it is working with you. So thank you so much for pointing that out. That’s so super important. So at the end of the conversation, a lot of people talk about closing and closing techniques. I talk about invitations, what do you talk about and how do you get to the moment where you ask the question if they want to move ahead, or you don’t ask the question, I don’t know how you handle this.

Okay, so it’s interesting that you would ask about closing techniques because I don’t teach traditional closing techniques. If you go to traditional closing techniques, there is a whole raft of psychological based and NLP based techniques designed to effectively manipulate somebody into saying, yes, they do work a lot of the time, they’re very effective, you might get the Yes, but you don’t necessarily get the psychological and emotional. So you don’t necessarily get the emotional buying and the emotional commitment to the process with you. So I don’t teach closing techniques, although that doesn’t mean that you don’t ask somebody to work with you at all. So in my seven-step process, step seven actually asks for the dub. Step seven is to ask for the decision. So it’s not enough to be thinking, well, I’ve just taken them through this whole sales process, they know what I do. And so of course, they know it’s up to them to tell me if they want to go ahead or not.

It’s there’s almost an unspoken etiquette to sales conversations. In the same way, there’s almost an unspoken etiquette to dating. If you’re the business owner, and you’ve guided them through the sales conversation, your client is sort of expecting you to be the ones pop the question, just like in traditional dating, I know that we don’t all do traditional dating, but traditional dating, the man will ask you on the first day, he’ll ask you in the next day, and it’s the man who finally pops the question to get engaged. It’s the same in sales. Actually, if you don’t ask your client, if they want to make a decision, they can leave that call feeling really weird, like something didn’t happen, that was supposed to happen, there’s almost a lack of closure. And both of you can go off feeling really awkward and really uncomfortable. So step seven is directly ask the client, if they want to go ahead and work with you, then you can ask that as directly or as softly as you want. There are different ways of doing it, depending on your level of comfort, that the important thing is that you’re very clear that you’re asking for that decision. And what you’re really aiming for in your sales conversation is a yes or no, you as far as possible.

You want to be getting a yes or no. But I don’t teach actual traditional closing techniques. And of course, this brings me back to what we talked about in the previous interview that we did where I talked about the internal Yes. And so the way that I see it is if you can conduct a very effective sales conversation following that seven steps to yes process while you’re presenting your solution, and the way that you would help somebody, your client will be getting what I call this internal Yes, where internally they have this like energetic pulling forward feeling of oh, yes, I think I actually might want to do this. And if you have that feeling, you don’t need to use more heavy-handed closing techniques. Your client, yes, they are going to have resistance, there might be fear investing that much money or concern that they don’t have time, or maybe they’ve tried something like it once before, and it didn’t work, and they’re a bit nervous about going ahead. But if you’ve got the internal yes, these concerns become things that you can coach and guide and work through with the clients to help them come to that decision. And if somebody doesn’t have the internal Yes, no amount of closing techniques are going to get them to be a yes, you might get a yes out of them verbally, but you won’t have the emotional internal connected yes, which is what you really need if that client is not just going to become a client today. But they’re still going to want to be your client tomorrow. And they’re still going to want to be your client by the time of your first session. There’s no point getting yeses from people who wake up the next morning, and realize it was a terrible mistake and contact you to cancel.

Yeah, I just love that. It’s so so so important that you guide people. And do you believe getting a decision in the call? Like the yes or no? Or is it a good idea to leave it with a maybe?

So here’s what I teach. I teach that in your sales conversation, you should be aiming to come off that conversation with a clear Yes. And a deposit or payment of that client and has been booked in the diary. So there’s no question you will know it’s happening, or a clear No. Or at least if it’s not a clear No. All of the things that they’ve said to try and not say no, but they’re too polite. You recognize that as a no. So you energetically can just walk away and let that go. That’s the ideal. And the reason I teach that is because most small business owners who are not comfortable with sales don’t have enough of a clear focus on their sales conversations and the conversations and the poor wooly and they don’t ask to invite the client to go ahead. And a lot of these clients would actually say yes if you only asked them. However, where I differ from a lot of what I call more aggressive sales approach is, is there’s a very commonly taught sales approach which I call the “Buy Right Now”, or eff off forever style of sales, which is basically, you know, if you know, people say things like, well, if you’re not in a position to commit right now, then you’re obviously not a decisive action taker. And I only work with decisive action takers. So if you’re not willing to commit right now, the offers off the table, and you’ll never get to speak to me again, ever. That is so totally, um, the antithesis of that type of sale,

Shutting a door in people’s faces.

Yeah, it’s nasty. And it doesn’t. And it definitely doesn’t lead to referrals. So one of the things that I’ve always built my business around has been referrals from satisfied clients. No one, no one’s going to refer their best friend to have that experience if they’ve just had that experience. But so I also, but I also respect the fact that we have different decision-making processes, and that for all sorts of reasons, not everyone will be able to come to a decision there and then on that call. And so rather than saying, if you can’t decide right now, the offer is off the table, and I’m never going to be your friend again. Then sometimes it does make sense to allow people some space to, but I wouldn’t be happy with something as vague as a maybe I’d want to know what the maybe is about what’s going on for you that it’s a maybe, is there something that I didn’t? Is there something that I didn’t explain very well? Is there a concern that you’ve got that you haven’t mentioned?

You want to be helping people through that so that you know exactly where it is? And when you understand what the maybe is the maybe might be? Well, maybe. But it depends if this payment I was expecting has arrived in my bank account yet. Or it’s maybe because it depends if that’s the three weeks that my husband is booking our holiday, I just need to check. There are some maybes that are completely acceptable, but always booking the next call, so you never leave it open-ended. So you would always get off that call understanding exactly what the reason is, your client can’t make the decision right now, what it is they need to figure out or check out. And when you’re speaking again, and some people who are more. So some people are very intuitive and gut-based and spontaneous. And we’ll just do it right now. Because it feels right. And other people are more analytical and reflective and just always want to sleep on it.

If especially if it’s a big decision, that’s just their decision-making style is so much more helpful for that type of person to be able to say, you know, I totally understand that this is your decision-making style to sleep on it and just checking with yourself in the morning. I respect that. How about we speak tomorrow at midday? And I’ll be able to answer any final questions you’ve got. And you can make your decision at that point. How does that sound? So you always know as the person who’s doing the selling, you always know where you stand, and where that person is on that. On that sort of continuum of seriousness. And there, there are cases where I, as the salesperson suggests somebody takes time to reflect, in particular, if I’m selling a quite high ticket item. So the highest ticket levels that I sell out in my business are between five and if I include the VAT that we have to charge in the UK between 6000 12000 pounds, so big investment.

There have been occasions where I’ve spoken to people about joining at that level who haven’t had much contact with me before, I’ve been recommended by a friend or they’ve just seen something that I do in the program starting in two days time, with a big investment like that. I’m often the one who suggests the reflection period. You know, I acknowledge we haven’t had we haven’t spoken before. I appreciate this is a big decision. And I am usually the one who suggests, why don’t you reflect on it? See what questions you’ve got. We’ll speak again tomorrow afternoon, I’ll be able to answer any further questions. And then we can go from there.


It can frighten people off. If you push people to big investment and they haven’t had a lot of contact with you before. You can often just fry it and people will just shut down and say no because it feels easier than being forced into a big, big decision on the spot.

Yeah, yeah. yeah, giving that space but also making sure that you ask that you get a clear yes or no. And if you get a maybe that you have a follow-up strategy, and you understand better what this is about. Because I’ve seen lots of people, they go for maybes and maybes. And then they think, Oh, yeah, I’m gonna have this client next week. And then this one person says, they said maybe so in two days time, they probably gonna turn around and come and buy, which will never ever happen if you don’t have a process in place. So, so, so important.

Yeah. And I mentioned in the at the first episode we recorded at the beginning, I was in a bit of a soapbox moment, I talked about the importance of, you know, I was talking about how this style of heart-centered sales is not soft sales, how its service at the highest level, and how we serve our clients by being willing to be courageous in those sales conversations. And this is one of those places if somebody says maybe, yes, it might take a bit of courage, but it’s time to ask the bold questions to actually understand what’s behind that may be, what is it? Is it a fear of something? Is it a very practical thing, because as the business owner, the worst thing you can do to yourself is let somebody leave your core with a maybe you just don’t know where you stand and energetically, you’ve got this sort of sticky glue that still connecting you to that client, being willing to have that conversation about what is that maybe, because it might well be something that you can unpack with them right now here on the call, it might just be might be coaching around something or some fear of, you know, it might be a reassurance or so often the maybe is something that if the potential client just gives voice to it, it’s something that you can help them through. And they wouldn’t, then they couldn’t figure it out on their own, even if you left them to think about it for two weeks.

Yeah, yeah. I just love that. So last question, because I obviously have to ask you, what does Heart Sells! mean to you?

Heart Sells! for me, you know, to me, of course, because of because my business is called the selling from the heart, like really, really similar. And then my, my style of sales is heart-centered sales. When I hear Heart Sells! I relate meaning to what it means in my business. So for me, the heart is around selling with love. Well, actually, I think with you, it’s slightly different perhaps with your heart, the hearts, I’m feeling like it’s selling with love, and also the Heart Sells! so that it’s the heart that sells as in it’s the hearts that people meet first, and responds to first. And that is what sells and then the sales process itself is almost a secondary piece. Because love and the heart are what comes first. And that sells for you before you even start having the conversation.

Beautiful. Awesome. Yeah, I want to lead people to your amazing, amazing gift, I highly recommend they check it out and get into that process. It’s the “Seven Steps to Yes, the Video Series” and we’re gonna put the link in the resource section to the show notes. So everything also all the links to you are just one click away. Tell us real quick, what are people getting in these “Seven Steps To Yes”.

So the seven steps to yes is a structure for an authentic guided sales conversation that still guides somebody to a decision. There is this is a series of videos, there are only three minutes they’re two to three minutes each. They’re very small, very bite-sized, but they give you this structure that you can follow straight away. And a lot of people feedback to me, it makes a huge difference to their sales conversations, even just this free series. And I also have an authentic sales styles quiz, to help people to identify why they might be struggling with sales. But also for every profile that struggles with sales. There’s a flip side that makes them naturally gifted and naturally good at sales, they just might not necessarily recognize it. So those two things together, I think are very, very useful. And yeah, the seven steps, the video training, step by step structure of you know what, what order to cover what things in, in order to guide that potential client to a decision in a way that feels very comfortable for them and doesn’t feel in any way pushy or sleazy or manipulative.

Hmm, beautiful. Well, thank you so, so much for having been here for sharing your wisdom. Obviously, I love what you do. And I’m so excited that they’re you know, there are people who do that beautiful work and have so much impact with all the heart-centeredness, feeling amazing having an amazing lifestyle and the level of success they wanted. And it’s all possible without the push, sleaze, or manipulation. So thank you so much for having been here.

You’re very welcome. Thank you for having me.

I had so much fun with Catherine Watkin and I highly recommend you hop on over to, you check out her podcast page with the show notes, the transcripts, all the links that connect to Catherine with just one click. I highly recommend you check out her and her work. I’m quite sure you will fall in love with her as I did, we connected, we talked, we could have talked for hours. And it says so beautiful to see what amazing work she does in the UK. Also, you want to get the “Seven Steps To Yes” which is her short video series. The link is right in the resource section, you will find that at or just hop on over to Christine Schlonski and find the podcast tab. When you’re over there, you can book your Sales Assessment in case you really want to turn your sales conversations into fun conversations and you know you need to work on your mindset a lot, then this is the right place to start. And if you feel you could really have some more clients in your pipeline.

Check out the Heart-Centered Lead Generation Summit Experience, also to be found at and The Experience tab, and that is a masterclass was 40, amazing experts sharing their knowledge, their best practices, their strategies around heart-centered lead generation, and you can tune in for free. Thank you so, so much for having been here. I hope this has served you greatly. We would love to hear so leave us a review. Leave us a rating at heart cells podcast on iTunes on Stitcher, and I am looking forward for you to tune into the next episode. Thank you so so much. Have a wonderful day, wherever you are in this beautiful world and I’m saying bye for now.


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ambitious entrepreneurs, Catherine Watkin, heart-centered expert, monetize, No to manipulative techniques, Not sleazy, pushy, sales, salespro, salesy, shifting mindset

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