Resources in this Episode:

Christine Schlonski [0:00]
Hi Gorgeous a welcome to episode number 15 was a wonderful Dondi Scumaci.

Dondi Scumaci [0:08]
Hello, this is Dondi Scumaci you’re listening to Heart Sells! with Christine Schlonski, enjoy.

Christine Schlonski [0:14]
Before we dive into the interview, gorgeous, make sure you check out the 7 Day Free Challenge to Ask for the Sale with Conference, you find the signup page at christineschlonski.com/challenge. And now let’s dive in. Dondi Scumaci is an international speaker known for her high energy presentations that produce dramatic results. She’s also a best selling author, and she has presented her workshops and keynotes all over the globe, like in the United States, Canada, Europe, Australia, South Africa, so just that you get an idea and today she is presenting with us and I’m so super excited for this conversation because we already have found out that we have a lot of things in common and I am super pumped to share her amazing wisdom with you. So welcome Dondi.

Dondi Scumaci [1:21]
It is a pleasure to be here. Thank you for inviting me.

Christine Schlonski [1:25]
Wonderful. You know, I just talked about your amazing bio and your new book that just is out their Career Moves. You’ve done so many wonderful things in your life, to empower people to actually live their life the way they wanted, because one thing you say is “Grow is about life well-lived” and I would like to start here for the listeners, is there anything of you or an aspect in your expertise that we are not aware of?

Dondi Scumaci [2:10]
I think that I, you know, my work, the work that I’ve, that I’ve put together over the years, probably comes from this place of I think I lived for a long time in my career, taking pretty good care of the things that were put on my plate. But I wasn’t reaching for things intentionally, right. So it’s very responsible, and I was dependable and quite successful. It wasn’t until much later that I figured out that I could design it right, I could design a life that was really suited to me, my strengths, my passions, right, my interests, my values, and that’s what I started to explore. Right? How do you empower people that would say that most of what I have put together, most of what I’ve learned, I have experienced, so for example, recently, someone wrote a thank you note to me for the book that I had written. And and they had read it and in the comment was, I found some power in that in that book. She said I was surprised at how low my confidence was, I didn’t even realize it. So maybe, maybe the expertise comes from the experience, right of being in that place where you’re not feeling super confident, or you-you aren’t, you aren’t designing a path or you aren’t connecting, as you would say, managing the value so that other people so that it resonates with other people.

Christine Schlonski [3:32]
Yeah, yeah, I totally that so totally resonates with me. And I know many people that are listening today are already entrepreneurs, or they’re thinking about being an entrepreneur and trying to figure out how can we make this work. And a very big issue is asking for what you truly want. And especially when you have a business, you need to ask for the sale, or you need to make an invitation to a sale. So how was your experience? Because, you know, you seem so confident and so self-assured, have you always been that way? Or was it something that you learned and that you developed in your life?

Dondi Scumaci [4:23]
I love that question. And the answer is no, I have not always been so self-assured, and so confident. And you know what, sometimes I’m still not right. Sometimes I still feel like, I lose my step a bit. And I have to step back and take that deep breath. And remember who I am. And remember the value that I drive. So a little bit of it, I think it’s about giving yourself emotional permission, I in my second book Grow and also in my first one Design for Success, I talked about the beliefs that limit us, and that’s an exercise I think every human and especially people who are moving in that entrepreneurial path, need to really step back and say, what, what do I believe that is empowering me, and what do I believe that’s limiting me. And, you know, when I really did that searching, and that exploring with my own belief system of what I believed about myself, about my ability, my capability, my value, I certainly did find some empowering beliefs that really fueled me and gave me that confidence to step out and to take some risks. But I also found some significant beliefs that limited me. And one of those, I, you know, I often joke about it, I have the the approval seeking gene in my body. And I think a lot of people, I want people to be pleased, I want them to be over the top pleased with my effort, right, I want them I want topspin on the ball, and never wanted to be mediocre. And so I would be constantly monitoring the reactions of everyone else. If I if I if I got the feeling that someone was displeased or didn’t approve, I would start to protect harder, work harder. And what I realized was, is that I was really that whole self-monitoring, getting all up in my own head was actually becoming a barrier. And I had to take that belief and it is important for people to approve of you. And I had to turn that into it is important to make an impact, because it’s not about you at all. It’s about them, it’s about the, it’s about the value that you’re delivering and if you make it about yourself, you’re going to get all up in your own head. Absolutely.

Dondi Scumaci [6:30]
So I also think, you know, you remind me of something that I’ve really been working on recently I ride a horse his name is Fortunato. So and Fortunato is a rescue horse he’s becoming kind of fancy in dressage. And when his trainer rides him, he’s very fancy, when I ride him, not so much yet, but I’m getting better. And I, and I remember, you know, not too long ago, I was in a, in a lesson with my instructor, and, and, and he, he would throw his shoulder he, you know, swing as hip out, we look drunk, we did, we looked like we were drunk, we couldn’t walk in a straight line. And, and he wasn’t really it wasn’t picking up on my cues. And she said,

Dondi Scumaci [7:13]
The problem is, is that you’ve not developed a core where you’re stabilized to where you, you’re reacting to everything that he’s doing. So when he slips a shoulder out, then you push on that shoulder, and then he slides the other way, you know, you’re just reacting and reacting, reacting, and then kind of reacting. And the two of you are just bouncing off of each other like a pinball. She said, what if you are to create a core, what if you were to create this stable core, and no matter what he’s doing, you hold your core, you keep inviting him back into that space, that more productive space, you stop reacting to it and you just find your own stability, so that no matter what’s going on, around you, or under you, in this example, you are stabilized. And it was amazing. And as I it from, from a horse riding perspective, it was amazing at the difference that it made. But I started thinking about that in our own lives as entrepreneurs, what if we were to create such a core and when I say core, that, that that, you know, to stabilize ourselves in the moment in those highly evaluative moments, in those moments when we’re asking for the business and those moments where we might not be feeling super confident. What if we had already created a core? And what would that look like, it would be a set of decisions that you make. So for example, for an entrepreneur might be the decision I make is that I am worth the money that I charge, right, I’m giving value, there’s an exchange there. And that’s a fair exchange, that’s a decision, right? Or maybe your core is some of the disciplines the things that you do every single day, whether you feel like it or not, right, so just and disciplines, and then skills. And as you build that, you’ll find that your core becomes established. And then even in the most challenging situations, with most challenging customers or scenarios, you find yourself just sitting up a little taller and being a little more certain of yourself.

Christine Schlonski [9:21]
That’s beautiful. I love it, especially the piece charging your worth because I have experienced so many heart-centered people, especially coaches or creatives or lightworkers, healers, who have such amazing gift but when it actually comes to ask for what they want, like what kind of energy exchange what kind of money they scramble, they kind of choke when they make their offer, or they lose momentum. And so how could they start to develop that core for themselves at what would be a little decision they could make today when listening now that would have an impact on future conversations with clients?

Dondi Scumaci [10:10]
I love that question. So, and I think I think we can all as entrepreneurs relate to it, as I was telling you is, we’re chatting before we started today, the, the, the podcast, I remember, when I first started speaking, I was a banker in my background, and I stepped out of banking to become a consultant and a speaker. And I was brand new to the whole thing. And I, I had so much to learn, and there was a lot of fear in that to, you know, that was, you know, going from, you know, being an executive of a, of a national bank to being a consultant, which is just code for unemployed really, I mean, let’s just say it like, it is right. And I and I did that intentionally it was a choice that I made because I decided I wanted to design a different life. But I remember not knowing what to charge, right. And I would, I was speaking a lot for free, I would speak to the club, right, the, you know, the business groups and the networking groups for free, and people really enjoyed it.

Dondi Scumaci [11:05]
But you don’t, you don’t live your life for free. So I’ve used that as being okay, there’s a season where you can practice you can hone your craft, you can develop a some referrals, right? You can get your name out there. But over time, and I love this advice from a friend of mine. And a wonderful author and speaker, very talented man, Mark Sanborn, he wrote the book called The Fred Factor among many others. But the Fred Factor is really one of those that stands out in the crowd of his books. And, and I asked him, I picked up the phone and called him at someone’s recommendation. And I said, know what, I don’t know what to charge. And his advice was just so brilliant. He said you charge whatever you can say, without stuttering, or blinking. And then as soon as that becomes comfortable, you double it. And you just keep doing that, right. And it sounds like frivolous. But I really think started out in a very low number. It did it, but I could say it without stuttering. And then once I got comfortable with that, so maybe a part of the advice is, there’s probably two sides of this advice. One is get used to speaking without apologizing or defending or justifying here is that here is the fee for my service, right? Here’s what I charge and then stop, don’t don’t you said, because sometimes I think we use fillers, like a lot, you know, I’m just or, you know, this is just or, you know, I’m not really too sure. No, it’s here is the price that I charge for my services. And then I would also say back that up was in, and here’s the benefit and the value that you’ll receive for that, right. So it is an exchange, I love what you said, an exchange of energy and exchange of value. So no, apologizing for your pricing. No kind of backing away from that it is just this is what the price is. But I also think that it’s it. The other side of that, that equation, beyond getting just comfortable with saying it without apologizing is also to really then focus on the value that you’re, you’re delivering not on the price. So when I was in, in, in banking, I used to when I and I was involved in the sales functions, I was in charge of the sales force for the bank. And one of the things I used to tell people is that you know, our customers will, you know, they will always pay for value perceived, right? So, you know, they will, they will pay what they perceive the value is. So if there’s a price issue, let’s talk about the value. But let’s not talk about the money. Let’s talk about the value because that’s really where the conversation should live, I think.

Christine Schlonski [13:38]
Yeah, yeah. And I totally agree. So the challenge many people have, and I’m quite sure you would agree is that seeing your own value for something that comes so easy to you, so natural, putting a price tag on it is quite a challenge when you start your own business. When you have to ask for somebody else like for company and I used to work in high ticket event sales over the phone for a long time, there was a price that was it, right? So you just ask for it. But then when you change and become an entrepreneur, it’s really a little challenge while little for some a big challenge. But it was a little challenge for me at the beginning to find out where do I want to start? What can I ask for? So how do you start, you said, You started out at a smaller price, how did you back yourself up and got clarity of what you actually delivered?

Dondi Scumaci [14:45]
You know, I think that it started to happen for me, because I started to receive the the thank yous and the here’s here, I put this into practice and here’s what it meant to me the stories of success where I started to see it in living color, the difference that I actually was making the impact that I was having. And I and and I realized that in, I really want to back up for a second and say, I appreciate so much what you just said, sometimes when something is our natural gift, maybe it comes very easy for us, maybe, then we tend to undervalue that, but really, I think that kind of gets back to that core is to realize what is really easy for you what comes naturally for you is not natural for everyone else, right. So it’s really been kind of connecting back with, again, the value that you are you are delivering.

Dondi Scumaci [15:39]
But also I think some of it is just how we talk to ourselves. It’s what we say to ourselves, like, the neural linguists tell us that 70% of our self-talk is negative. We beat ourselves up all day long from the inside out, right. So it’s really hard to then go out and be super dynamic with other people when we’re beating ourselves up from the inside out. So, you know, when I talk about identifying those limiting beliefs, this is another example of that, where are you limiting yourself. And I think that some of this is pure negotiation or influence gets back to that idea of it isn’t an exchange of value, right? That it is an exchange, if you start to see it more as an exchange of value, and making sure that the value that you receive is, is on par with the value that you give, right. And so doing some doing some introspection, some reflection around that, and really being able to speak to the value of what you deliver, not the products that you deliver, but the difference your product makes. And I think sometimes we just talk about ourselves in the wrong way. Like I see the LinkedIn profiles all over the place. And if you review hundreds of those, you’ll see it’s my name is my title, it’s my position, it’s my company. That’s not what you do, right? That that’s not the impact that so we’re so busy talking about our title, or our position versus the difference we make the impact we have. And I think if we could really center on that, and probably goes back to that core to be so in touch with the value that you create. And, and, and you’re so able to tell that value story that at some point with practice and by the way, that’s that’s part of the core to it’s just practice. When I talked to you about the riding that didn’t happen in one lesson. It wasn’t just one time she said, What if you were to strengthen your core? I started doing exercises I started practicing every single day. And, you know, it was very interesting is when I would straighten myself up it was actually it felt awkward. I felt uncomfortable because I was not used to that kind of posture. And now I feel uncomfortable if I’m slouching, right? So it was muscle memory. It was practice, it was exercise, it might be standing in front of the mirror right in your in your home and delivering that price, that quote with the benefit and the value not blinking, not flinching, right, so some of this is just about sheer practice, you do it so many times that it starts to feel more natural for you. And that may take a little while, especially if you’re uncomfortable at the beginning. But I promise you if you practice it over time, it will not be.

Dondi Scumaci [18:32]
So now when someone calls me or they email to say, will you we know what would your fee be? I am happy to my comment is I was I’m happy to share my fee structure with you. Before I do that, I’d like to talk about what you’re trying to accomplish, right. I wanna make sure that this is the right that we’re not just talking about money that we’re talking about value. And I’ll actually say that I’d rather talk about value first, then we can decide on the money, right. So. So I think that that that is a language that people speak as well. One last thing too, is if you’re searching for those limiting beliefs, here’s a little exercise for one week, write down, keep a log of yourself talk. If you don’t know what those beliefs are, I promise you for one week, you kind of keep track of what are you saying to yourself, you’re going to find some empowering belief that I’m really worth this. I bring value my strengths and my skills are specialized. And they are they are they are well developed. Right? I have invested in my skill set I have invested in in in my trade, right. And you’ll you’ll hear some also probably limiting beliefs. Is that too much? Was that good enough? Am I good enough? Right? So I think that to some degree is really about doing some of that reflective work to say, What am I believing about myself? . You know, and so if there’s any part of you, that’s wonder who am I worth that, that’s where you start? Because yes, you are, you absolutely are worth it.

Christine Schlonski [20:09]
Yeah, Wonderful. Wonderful. And, and guys, just that, you know, Dondi has an amazing, amazing program. It’s called mentor in a box. Because we both have mentors and have had coaches forever so we can get to our next level, you can craft the gifts make it better add more value. And that would be a really cool way for you to join her mentorship by mentor and a box, I’m going to put you in the link in the show notes. So make sure you do check that out. What I would like to ask you, Dondi when you talk about the value, so you don’t you don’t answer the price question right away. Because with so many people come and the first question they have is basically what does it cost? And they from the mindset, that’s already like a scarcity mindset, because it’s not what do I need? And then

Dondi Scumaci [21:11]
or what do I receive? Right? Yeah,

Christine Schlonski [21:12]
yeah, then I figured out the money part. It’s like, what does it cost and talking about cost, like, all the time, I, I have had people in my life earlier on before I made sure my environment was more supportive that always talk well, you know, this cost this much and then I don’t know, I got this beautiful shoes. And it was like, there was always a price tag. So I had this conversation actually, I was like, I It doesn’t matter. Like, it’s a value, like, what are you getting out of it. So when you just said the exercise where people can have selftalk log and see their limiting beliefs or their beliefs in general, like a person that permanently talks about prices of things, has probably a money challenge.

Dondi Scumaci [22:10]
I think that’s, I think that that’s insightful what you just said. And I know that there have been times in my life where, and by the way, if I, I believe human beings were a little bit like this, if I if I can find the value in it, I’m gonna find a way to pay for it. Yeah, right. If there’s, if the value resonates enough, that I’m going to find a way to pay for it, I will not let the price of something keep me from having that value in my life. And it’s not really even about stuff, but maybe an experience or, you know, maybe it’s a, you know, maybe it’s a expected to be a little bit of a minimalist and in terms of, I don’t need more stuff, but I do want to learn and I want to grow. And, you know, sometimes people say, how much does it cost to have a horse, people always ask them, you know, when I say all of it, it costs all of it, right? It’s not, but the value that I received from that experience, and what I’m learning about myself and about know just about growth, and taking risks, and being brave, and having some courage and stretching yourself, there’s no price that can be placed on it. What we pay for something is important, up to the point of, are we are we receiving the value in return? So I really do you know, when people would say, Well, how much do you charge, you know, I think we’d have to get ready with maybe some of our scripts, right, I could acknowledge that I could say, you know, what you pay for the services that you receive is important. In my experience, the value is the thing that really counts, let’s talk about what you’re trying to create. Let’s talk about what you’re what you’re trying to accomplish through this the impact that you’re trying to have, because want to make sure that and I will talk to you, I want to make sure that that exchange of money to value is something you feel great about, right, let’s not focus on that. Let’s focus on the value and let’s make sure that when we get to the money part of it, that exchange is not only appropriate, but it’s something that that that makes a lot of sense for you. So I like having our scripts ready. I in sales, I used to when I was managing sales and sales folks, I would often say we would have what we would call an objections lab. And we would, we would write down every possible objection that a customer might have to the price, your rates are too high, your fees are too high, whatever that might be. And we would develop a would develop a response. And, and we would we would write that response out. And it was amazing the experience I had in the end, by the way, the format that we use, we would always acknowledge the objection or the price question or the concern, and it might sound like what you pay for the services is very important, of course, right. That’s just the acknowledgment. But then we would respond with something that, you know, let’s take a look at the value over time, let’s take a look at the impact that this will have so that we can make sure that price is reasonable for you. How does that sound?

Dondi Scumaci [25:05]
So the format is, acknowledge, respond, and then ask another question to keep the, you know, the flow of things going on. Well, what’s really interesting about that process is that these salespeople that I that I work personally with, we, we would have these objection labs all of the time. And they became so good, not that they were ever reading the script, but just by the fact that they had as a group collaborated and formulated these responses. It just, it was just natural for them. And literally, there was nothing that a customer could say that would stop them. They were just so comfortable and so confident with their offerings. It was they were, they were wildly successful. So in this organization, I had a couple of the other my colleagues and peers saying, could you after hearing about this discipline, there’s that core thing again, being ready for those objections? They said, Could you type out those responses and then send them to me, everybody in all of the branches? Of course, we’re happy to share. But what I realized was that you know, as a sales manager, when I would go into the branches, and I would hear a customer object into a fee, or, or this was my favorite I’m saying: I’d like to close my account. And I would hear Okay. You know, what, a second there’s a script for that. But what I realized was that if you weren’t doing the heavy lifting, of really thinking through how would I acknowledge that? How would I respond to that? What’s the question that I could ask to keep the conversation moving and guide the conversation unless you were involved in the process of creating those responses, it was just a hollow script. It doesn’t work to just hand that to someone. So really, that’s just a very tactical takeaway is to make sure that you have brainstormed and developed a response, a quality response for every objection that you that you ever could encounter and the confidence that you feel when you’re just ready. Maybe you’ll never hear those objections, that’s fine, too. But knowing that you’re ready in case that does come up, that’s a confidence builder preparation.

Christine Schlonski [27:10]
What a great interview. I just love the idea that you really just sit down and then you think about all the objections and questions your customer could have. And this leads to clarity and clarity leads to focus and what we focus on expands. So if you’re ready to expand your business, your revenue if you’re ready to serve more people that is such a beautiful way to go. Thank you so much, Dondi for sharing all your wisdom with us today. And I’m looking forward to the next episode. And for you gorgeous, make sure you sign up for the 7 Day Free Challenge to Ask for the Sale with Confidence you will dive into seven days you and I will trainings with support so you can sell from your heart with ease, grace, confidence and on your terms. Hop on over to www.christineschlonski.com/challenge or just christineschlonski.com for the amazing resources, the show notes the transcript or the podcast pages and check out the podcast section on this page. Have a wonderful day. Please subscribe if you haven’t already. And make sure you tune into the next episode with Dondi where she keeps sharing her amazing advice, knowledge, wisdom so you can be set up for your sales game in 2019 and have even more fun and serve more people. Thank you so much for tuning in and till next time. Bye for now.